Question

Does 2 Thessalonians 1 and 2 prove a pre-tribulation rapture?

Answer

It does not. If you're going prove a pre-tribulation rapture you can't do it here. You want to ask another question?

Question

This question is, does it prove a post-tribulation rapture?

Answer

No it does not. It doesn't prove any time factor with the tribulation. But I do not believe that we're going find in 2 Thessalonians, I think you find that which wonderfully fits the pre-tribulation view and which does not fit the post-tribulational view. But I don't think you're going to prove the point in this text.

Question (continued)

Third question, for example, take verse 1:7, he's talking in the context to the Thessalonians about their perseverance and so on and so forth. And it talks about “and to give relief to you who are afflicted and to us as well, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with His mighty angels, and flaming fire dealing out retribution to those who do not know God, and to those who do not obey the Gospel of the Lord Jesus.” And then he talks about damnation and when He comes to be glorified in that Day, in the Saints, and etc., etc., and that sounds an awful lot more like Revelation 20 than pre-tribulational rapture.

Answer (continued)

Yes, it is talking about that, it is talking about ultimate judgment, it is not talking about the rapture. In other words, from verse 5 on, you have the statement about the return of Christ. That being His Second Coming in flaming fire taking vengeance on the ungodly. That is really culminating in the Great White Throne judgment, right? Your asking why is that a comfort to the church?

Questioner

Yes, specifically the word "relief" in verse seven.

Answer (continued)

Well I think the comfort comes to the believer. What he's saying is, why are we comforted if we’re not going to be here anyway, I guess, or why are we comforted by the statement about the ultimate judgment. I think because it gives to us the sense of the fact that no matter what happens here, ultimately God is going to bring justice to the whole system. And we may be persecuted and we may endure the treachery of the world, and we may endure all the flack that the world throws at us, but we can be comforted in the knowledge that ultimately God is going to judge the sin of the world, and those who have turned against His Son and the people of His Son. So all you have there is a general statement relative to that. Then from there he goes to describing the things that are going to happen prior to that event, in chapter 2. Does that help?

You know I wish that I could be more specific, but I'm not sure I understand what you're after. Well, one other statement I might make, is don't make verse 3 where it says "that day will not come except there come a falling away," don't make that the rapture. I think you'll have a lot of problems if you try to do that. And that has been done. I think it basically has to do with an apostasy, so what you're going to have is the judgment but prior to the judgment you're going to have a falling away and an apostasy and you're going to have the revealing of the man of sin, you’re going to have all those things and I think those take place during the tribulation. Some of them had actually thought they were in the tribulation and they had missed the rapture. And he saying, no, that's yet to come. Some of them thought they missed the Second Coming, I guess is a better way to put it. But he said. no, you didn't miss it, it's going to come. but this is going to precede it and so forth and so on.